James Duncan and Fuhad Dawodu, Black British hosts of the award-winning podcast ShxtsNGigs, issued a public acknowledgement on their YouTube channel on Tuesday after landing themselves in hot water for laughing at racist jokes during their July appearance on controversial comedian Andrew Schulz’s podcast, Flagrant. The pair faced backlash last week when clips from their recent US podcast tour went viral.

On Flagrant, Schulz twisted the “Black girlfriend effect” (a trending social media term used positively to highlight how Black women’s influence improves their partners’ appearance and lifestyle) to joke that white men with Black female partners only improve their appearance under duress and physical violence. Schulz also made other racist remarks during the episode, including comments about slavery, disparaging opinions about Nigerian people and insinuating that James and Fuhad’s claims of being attracted to women of all races were a cover for their unspoken preference for white women, which Schulz claimed they were too embarrassed to admit.

Schulz’s comments are undeniably hurtful, harmful and racist; they dehumanise Black women and perpetuate the age-old stereotype that we’re aggressive while reinforcing the notion that Black women are unworthy of affection. 

Many online, particularly Black women, have been outraged at James and Fuhad, accusing them of laughing at their expense and allowing a white man to ridicule Black women to their faces. This is also especially egregious given the duo’s large Black female audience, who have played a significant role in their global success.

One user was appalled to log into X and find the pair, who they’d long supported, being rightfully criticised. Another user found the situation ironic, questioning why people continue to place their trust and affection in men with mics. “Why are you surprised? Genuinely,” they asked.

Listeners of the ShxtsNGigs podcast feel hurt and betrayed. Given our general scepticism towards male podcasters due to the prevalence of toxic masculinity in the genre, we had trusted James and Fuhad’s seemingly harmless and jovial cheeky charm. Unlike prominent male podcasters such as Joe Budden, Amrou and Myron from Fresh and Fit and Brian Atlas from Whatever, shows that frequently surface online with problematic clips disparaging women, the duo are often considered some of the few men with microphones women happily engage with. Black women are often the targets of harmful vitriol from Black, male podcasters who use barefaced misogyny in an attempt to appeal to incels, self-proclaimed “alphas” and legions of Andrew Tate stans. When the hosts of Fresh and Fit insisted they were not “night riders” and don’t date “Sheniquas”—derogatory terms for dark-skinned Black women— they doubled down after receiving backlash. Following the incident, Amrou and Myron appeared on Andrew Schulz’s Flagrant, and Schulz encouraged them to stand by their controversial remarks rather than dismiss them as jokes. Such comments are emblematic of the toxic masculinity and misogynoir that we’ve become accustomed to from the genre.

We thought James and Fuhad were different.

The duo’s popularity (more than 8.3 million followers across platforms and more than 400 million views on TikTok) partly stems from viral clips showcasing their playful banter and genuine friendship. Many of us were first introduced to them through a viral clip where James, in a rare display of male vulnerability, jokingly expresses jealousy over Fuhad spending more time with his friend Tobi than with him. This moment, along with their frequent lighthearted banter about their lives, created a refreshing contrast to other male-dominated podcasts that often perpetuate toxic masculinity (making sexist and judgemental remarks, inserting themselves and their uneducated opinions in women’s issues, etc…) ShxtsNGigs seemed to offer a positive alternative that rejected hyper-masculine narratives in favour of a more supportive and emotionally open dynamic. It makes their betrayal of trust all the more painful for their audience, who had seen them as an exception to the toxicity that pervades much of the podcasting space.

It’s worth noting that many of today’s podcast listeners aren’t actually tuning in to full episodes. Instead, they’re consuming short, viral clips on social media. It’s likely that James and Fuhad’s most vocal supporters may not have listened to full ShxtsnGigs episodes. The podcast duo have benefited from a curated online image that might not fully capture the nuances of their views or behaviour. 

Many of ShxtsNGig’s captive Black British female audience have admitted that while they find James and Fuhad funny, they are unsurprised by the latest controversy and claim they have frequently made misogynistic comments on their podcast. Clips have since been excavated from recently deleted podcast episodes, where the duo implied Black women are undesirable and more recently on Flagrant, Fuhad recalls a time, when he groped a woman.

As the controversy reverberates across a global audience, Black women in the UK and US have expressed their exasperation at facing more blatant misogynoir from online personalities. For Black British women, the disappointment hits even closer to home.

Perhaps our lack of surprise also stems from the fact that James and Fuhad’s reaction feels all too familiar. We’ve all come across or know Black men who made fun of us in the playground at school, fetishise mixed-race and light-skinned women, ignored us on dating apps in favour of white women, and don’t advocate for or protect us in corporate spaces or online. 

In their apology, the pair admitted that their laughter was inappropriate and hurtful to their audience. James explained that their laughter was a “fight or flight” response in an uncomfortable situation, which they tried to address by repeatedly asking the host Schulz to “move on.”

This explanation falls flat for a few reasons. While the two admit their wrongdoing and stress their reaction shouldn’t be excused, they offer little meaningful engagement with the specific harm caused and fail to address Black women directly, opting instead to apologise to their “community.” It’s plausible that even when apologising, they felt awkward and uncomfortable to find themselves in a position where they’re being cancelled online. It is possible that they wanted to apologise quickly, take accountability, and “move on.”

James added that it’s easy for onlookers to say they would have reacted differently on Flagrant and “flipped the cameras” angrily. But that is not what we expect from someone confronted with racism or comments disparaging Black women. We expected either one of them to challenge Schulz’s comments, explain why they were unacceptable and then “move on”. If we’re to give them the benefit of the doubt, these were two 30-something men who, shocked, awkwardly reacted to something that in retrospect, they shouldn’t have.

But we can’t let them off the hook so easily. James claimed they were surprised by the racist jokes on Flagrant, which is hard to believe given Andrew Schulz’s reputation for racist humour. Considering James and Fuhad’s growing popularity, they likely had many options for podcast appearances and chose to appear on Flagrant. Not only does this suggest they themselves enjoy Schulz’s humour but we could also argue that they were hoping for buy-in into Schulz’s white male audience, even if that came at the expense of their Black female audience. 

The Flagrant clips, originally published in July, initially caused some backlash when released, however, the pair remained silent until Monday when the clips went viral. This week, their team allegedly deleted their first 100 episodes after early ShxtsNGigs clips surfaced on X, featuring disparaging comments about Black women. This has only fueled suspicions that they may hold, or previously held, anti-Black views that they now wish to hide to protect their squeaky-clean image and future business deals. 

It’s ultimately up to their audience to decide whether to accept this apology. Rebuilding trust will require consistent actions that demonstrate their commitment to supporting and protecting Black women. And for the sake of their business, it’s highly unlikely they’ll repeat this mistake. 

For me, this whole controversy is such a bummer. It serves as a painful reminder that Black men often perpetuate misogynoir as a rite of passage and a toxic phase in their personal development. Black women are always caught in the crossfire of other people’s growth. In laughing along, James and Fuhad confirmed my and many other Black women’s lingering suspicion that Black men do not value us and when push comes to shove, will not protect us.

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